Suggestions and Queries from Andrew

Andrew · 2008-06-03 07:24

1) Denis, instead of displaying those ugly boxes in place of CR/LF, can we have some other character or maybe just a space instead?

2) Also, on compiling the script you gave here, why do I get the message shown above ([Line 0] Hint: Variable 'FILEPATH' never used)?

3) If I compile a script and get an error in Line X, on pressing OK wouldn't it be better to automatically go to Line X? That is naturally the first thing one will do when faced with an error, right?

4) One more really important thing for people like me who still believe in using the keyboard along with the mouse in order to be more productive - please implement keyboard accelerators/shortcuts for the buttons in the program! Currently, buttons like Try to Compile, Go To, Scripts, Help etc. in the Add PascalScript Rule dialog can neither be selected with the keyboard using Tab, nor do they have any keyboard accelerators/shortcuts assigned. So one has to use the mouse for those buttons. Not very good from an accessibility perspective too, for blind users for example.

Last edited by Andrew (2008-06-03 07:49)

den4b · 2008-06-21 14:07

1) Denis, instead of displaying those ugly boxes in place of CR/LF, can we have some other character or maybe just a space instead?
I have no idea how you got those CR/LF characters displayed, because I explicitly replace both of these control characters with spaces. What version are you using?? Can you replicate this in the latest version?

2) Also, on compiling the script you gave here, why do I get the message shown above ([Line 0] Hint: Variable 'FILEPATH' never used)?
If you look in the Help document, you'll find that PascalScript has two registered/reserved variables: FilePath and FileName. PascalScript gives hints when defined variables are not used, so you can eliminate them from the script. In this case you can ignore this message, because you can't eliminate FilePath variable.

3) If I compile a script and get an error in Line X, on pressing OK wouldn't it be better to automatically go to Line X? That is naturally the first thing one will do when faced with an error, right?
Damn right! And that is exactly what I wanted to do some time ago, but something has stopped me. So I decided to at least add the "Go To Line" option. Can't remember now what it was. Maybe it is the fact that user may not want the cursor to jump automatically to a different location, in case of long scripts for example.

4) ...please implement keyboard accelerators/shortcuts for the buttons in the program! Currently, buttons like Try to Compile, Go To, Scripts, Help etc.
I agree on this one too. Unfortunately, there is always a trade-off between accessibility and cleanness. In order to have those buttons flat (without ugly borders) - I have to use TSpeedButton component which unfortunately does not have a window handle. This means that these components cannot receive keyboard focus, and it makes it hard to implement any sort of accessibility features like keyboard accelerators and shortcuts.

I can make several hardcoded shortcuts: Ctrl+T for "Try to Compile", Ctrl+G for "Go To", F1 for "Help"? What do you think?

Andrew · 2008-06-22 16:03

den4b wrote:

I have no idea how you got those CR/LF characters displayed, because I explicitly replace both of these control characters with spaces. What version are you using?? Can you replicate this in the latest version?

I was getting those characters with the previous beta, but the latest one (dated 21 Jun 2008) is ok. So problem solved I guess!

den4b wrote:

Damn right! And that is exactly what I wanted to do some time ago, but something has stopped me. So I decided to at least add the "Go To Line" option. Can't remember now what it was. Maybe it is the fact that user may not want the cursor to jump automatically to a different location, in case of long scripts for example.

Hmm, I'm sorry Denis, but that explanation doesn't make sense. After all, the user will have to go to the offending line sooner or later, right? Ok, if for some reason the current behaviour will not be changed, then how about this? When there's an error after compiling, then pressing the Go To button should show the line number of the line with the error. As of now the current line number is shown, which is useless. This will mean that if there's an error after compiling, the user will need to press an extra Go To button, but at least he won't have to enter the line number and can directly press Enter. That ought to save some time, right?

den4b wrote:

I can make several hardcoded shortcuts: Ctrl+T for "Try to Compile", Ctrl+G for "Go To", F1 for "Help"? What do you think?

Yup, that should be fine Denis! And it would be great if the tooltips on those buttons mentioned those shortcuts, if that's possible. That'll certainly help new users.

Here's another suggestion:

5) We can select multiple files in the file list by dragging the mouse, or by Shift+Clicking or even by Ctrl+Clicking. Is the same behaviour not possible with the Rules section too? We can remove all rules using Shift+Del or the context menu, but what if we want to remove multiple rules at once? Of course we can select them one-by-one and press Remove every time, but how about adding a Shift+Click and Ctrl+Click feature as well?

Stefan · 2008-06-22 19:59

Andrew wrote:

Here's another suggestion:

Andrew,
would you do us an favor an open an new thread for each new suggestion?

Thank you ;-)

Andrew · 2008-06-23 18:38

Sure, no problem, if that's what the forum rules say. No extra effort for me anyway. I actually thought that since this topic already deals with 4 suggestions of mine, why clutter up the forum with one more topic when I can just append to this one? But if opening a new topic is what it takes for Denis to read it, then you can expect many more new topics from me in the future!

Stefan · 2008-06-24 06:58

It's not "for Denis to read it"

It's to be clear what answer / mention / suggestion / etc. is for what question / answer / mention / suggestion / etc.
And if another user has the same question it's easier for him to find an answer (and for us to point him to) ...
... if one us proper Subject like "[<app name>] Problem in short words"

IMHO

Ahh, and BTW...

Andrew wrote:

... then you can expect many more new topics from me in the future!

... have you read this? : Great and not so great...

Last edited by Stefan (2008-06-24 07:02)

Andrew · 2008-06-25 07:58

Stefan wrote:

Ahh, and BTW... ... have you read this? : Great and not so great...

Yes, I have. And I fail to see where it says that users are forbidden from making requests for help or opening tons of new topics to provide their valuable suggestions etc.? If Denis wants to kill off development completely and move on to other things in life, that's his decision after all and all he needs to do is to close the forums and only keep the download links. Or else he can close the suggestions and bugs section and keep the forums alive only for users to help each other in the future. Or he can open source the tools. In any case, there are tons of options open to him to do as he sees fit.

All my suggestions so far have been politely worded and no demands have been made of anyone. I understand that other users may not be like that. Denis will no doubt come across people who'll cajole, threaten, request, demand etc. from him. As he's made amply clear however, he's going to devote time to these utilities only as and when he sees fit, which is absolutely fine by me. So I don't see how opening lots of new topics is going to be a problem, unless Denis himself cannot resist answering them! If he keeps to his promise of limiting his involvement to a sane level, then it shouldn't really matter if topics pile up. He'll answer them when he's ready (or maybe not at all). I understand this (and hope others do too), but that is not going to stop me from making suggestions if I have some good ideas in my mind. Implementation is in Denis' hands, but the freedom to suggest (unless he explicitly forbids it) is in ours.

Thanks to Denis for these awesome tools,

Cheers,

Andrew

P.S. No offense Stefan to you or the other extremely helpful members of this forum. I know you may have just been partly kidding but still... What I wrote above are just my thoughts on the present situation as I see it. If you feel differently about posting many new topics, do let me know why.

Last edited by Andrew (2008-06-25 08:02)

Stefan · 2008-06-25 12:34

Andrew wrote:

... If you feel differently about posting many new topics, ...

No one says something about this. Except for "many" perhaps...

den4b · 2008-06-25 19:33

Come on guys, you are both trying to help, in your own way! Both of you have a point, but I don't want to see you fighting/arguing about this. Andrew, I think you joined us after that disaster stroke, so you might not be aware of the extent and the details of it. Stefan has been here a lot longer and he is more aware of these problems, so he often helps me out with the forum.

Anyway, I strongly agree that topics should have proper/descriptive subjects, so users can have at least a clue on what the topic is about just by reading its subject. This goes a long way. It is ok to put similar suggestions at the same topic, as long as they are somehow related. This makes it a lot easier to track them and reference them in the future (as Stefan already mentioned). You first 4 suggestions where fine together, as they all relate to design of the PascalScript rule, and hence the subject could've been something like "PascalScript design issues and improvements". But your 5-th suggestion would fit better in a new topic, as it has nothing to do with your previous suggestions. I 'm sure you'll understand what we are trying to explain.

Andrew wrote:

5) We can select multiple files in the file list by dragging the mouse, or by Shift+Clicking or even by Ctrl+Clicking. Is the same behaviour not possible with the Rules section too? We can remove all rules using Shift+Del or the context menu, but what if we want to remove multiple rules at once? Of course we can select them one-by-one and press Remove every time, but how about adding a Shift+Click and Ctrl+Click feature as well?

I made it simple (no multi-selection) for a reason. This saves me from worrying about multiple rules been selected for the moving, editing, etc. I can still implement multi-selection, but I didn't consider it to be important, and carried on with more important tasks.

Andrew · 2008-06-26 16:01

den4b wrote:

Come on guys, you are both trying to help, in your own way! Both of you have a point, but I don't want to see you fighting/arguing about this.

I didn't even think we were fighting or arguing to be honest Denis, till you pointed it out! We're all mature individuals here, so why should we fight? I was only clarifying my stand on posting "many" new topics (which Stefan seemed to disagree with), since, despite the problems of the past, you've not forbidden anyone from doing this. Anyway, let's move on...

den4b wrote:

Andrew, I think you joined us after that disaster stroke, so you might not be aware of the extent and the details of it. Stefan has been here a lot longer and he is more aware of these problems, so he often helps me out with the forum.

Actually, I read through all those posts and got a fair idea of what had happened. Basically, you were too deeply involved with these projects (because you've so lovingly developed them and couldn't just drop them suddenly) and had problems with keeping this part of your life from eating into all the free time you had. Eventually you came to a point where you had to decide one way or the other and you did, after you took a much-needed break and a calmer head prevailed. I appreciate what Stefan and others have done so far, which is why I wrote that small postscript note at the end. No issues on my part so as I said above, let's move on to better things.

den4b wrote:

But your 5-th suggestion would fit better in a new topic, as it has nothing to do with your previous suggestions. I 'm sure you'll understand what we are trying to explain.

That makes perfect sense and the suggestion will be followed henceforth.

den4b wrote:

I can still implement multi-selection, but I didn't consider it to be important, and carried on with more important tasks.

Well, naturally if there are more important tasks then it can be put on the back burner. It's not a do or die situation if that feature isn't implemented. It would just be nice to have, but obviously you have better things to implement so that's fine.

den4b Forum

#1 2008-06-03 07:24

Suggestions and Queries from Andrew

#2 2008-06-21 14:07

Re: Suggestions and Queries from Andrew

#3 2008-06-22 16:03

Re: Suggestions and Queries from Andrew

#4 2008-06-22 19:59

Re: Suggestions and Queries from Andrew

#5 2008-06-23 18:38

Re: Suggestions and Queries from Andrew

#6 2008-06-24 06:58

Re: Suggestions and Queries from Andrew

#7 2008-06-25 07:58

Re: Suggestions and Queries from Andrew

#8 2008-06-25 12:34

Re: Suggestions and Queries from Andrew

#9 2008-06-25 19:33

Re: Suggestions and Queries from Andrew

#10 2008-06-26 16:01

Re: Suggestions and Queries from Andrew

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